I just scored a CARF MX2

marksextra

Well-Known Member
T.O.M.
A little more opinion about the actual damage you see given your experience level would be personally helpful. I'm not going after him so any opinion here is simply for my peace of mind. You can 'pm' me if you wish as I will keep all correspondence in confidence.

Yes, I believe he shipped it usps though.
 

Tired Old Man

Staff member
I would too. I'll even allow a link to this thread.

For future reference, your air set up helped some but it didn't do as much as you would think. The prop acts like a solid disc and blocks a lot. Some got through above what normally would. Based upon what I've read in here so far there's no way you did the dirty deed. You sent me pics before you ran it and there was evidence of hot running then, which I told you about. OTH, not being able to see lower into the cylinder had me go with the reputation of the seller, which is was ok then but now lower than a dog turd, and guess there was no serious damage. 3W does not mar their products when they put them together so that was done by the owner. 3W really does like their engines to look good when the customer gets their hands on them. Put a piece of heat shrink tubing on the hex key and that kind of stuff doesn't happen.

From time to time I'll shave upper cylinder fins if I'm going to be using some type of plug cap modification. Wahoo has one of my old engines where that was done to accommodate a hose clamp instead of depending on a wire C spring to retain the caps. So if you read this Wahoo you can use a hose clamp on your caps if you file away the edge flanges on the caps;) The unusual fin mod makes me wonder what the previous owner was up to since I know of no cap design that mod would benefit.

Next time you set up cooling air, come at the cylinder from directly above or up close just behind the cylinders. The prop will handle distribution from there if you pump up the wind velocity. Toro electric leaf blowers from Home Depot are good for about 180mph of wind blast. They work quite well and I've worn out a few using them for that purpose;) They last a long time. Shop vacs aren't anywhere close to as good.
 
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marksextra

Well-Known Member
For future reference, your air set up helped some but it didn't do as much as you would think.

Next time you set up cooling air, come at the cylinder from directly above or up close just behind the cylinders. The prop will handle distribution from there if you pump up the wind velocity. Toro electric leaf blowers from Home Depot are good for about 180mph of wind blast. They work quite well and I've worn out a few using them for that purpose;) They last a long time. Shop vacs aren't anywhere close to as good.
Seller aside for a moment. I'd like to say that without your advice we experienced exactly what you're saying. :thumbsup:(not that you need reinforcement that you were right) With the air, without the air, we noticed not nearly what we thought we would. (we really did use guns like I said we did :thumbsup:) Our next test we decided to either use two electric leaf blowers; as I did on my last motor, OR use the current setup but try to blow the air from below as we planned to tie the hoses to the stand. It is so funny you should give us advice about what we had to learn the hard way. Good man. For me at least, that's half the fun though. When "I" do the work and experiment, then I KNOW what worked and what didn't . I KNOW what I'm talking about. I know when someone give good advice or not because "I" did the work myself. It must be a like learning.
 

marksextra

Well-Known Member
I thought he was a stand up guy? Now that I think about it some more, wasn't there another incident involving him a short while back? Can't remember what it was, but I thought he was good buds with the TFC guys out west. WTF? Damn, I was gonna ask him if he still had those L90 canisters he was trying to sell a while back.
Here you go bro. He just discounted and renewed the Votec ad and put the L90's up for sale.

http://www.flyinggiants.com/swapshop/showproduct.php?product=45015&title=l90-exhaust-cans&cat=16

I also sent a final email to him this morning letting him know that the engine pics are here and are up for discussion and his reputation isn't fairing well because of how he handled this sale. .....no reply from him.
 
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BVargas

3W Flyer
Please show us a pic of the top of the piston and one of the inside of the piston. Both Piston pin clips are still there yes?

BV
 

marksextra

Well-Known Member
Please show us a pic of the top of the piston and one of the inside of the piston. Both Piston pin clips are still there yes?

BV
This is what and how it was returned to me from Gerhard. Sorry for the picture quality but my camera phone apparently prefers natural light and it's dark here.
 

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Tired Old Man

Staff member
Ok guys, here's the deal. I just finished speaking with Barry after he reached out to me in a PM. Barry, like Mark, is a bit perplexed and would like to find a way to resolve the problem but he also wants to know how the engine got to the condition it's reputed to be in.

I'm not going to go into all the details of the conversation, and I certainly can't tell what condition anything is or was in based on all the pictures I've seen to date in this thread. As I said earlier, I never saw the piston skirts below the exhaust port levels or the cylinder walls any lower than the tops of the pistons. So here's the deal.

Let's call a truce for a little bit. No more good guy or bad guy. Barry suggested I take a look at the piston and cylinder that was returned from A.I. I agreed to do this with the understanding that I could tell if it was good or bad, but not be definitive in how or when it happened. OTH, I can develop a pretty good idea of how it happened and whether or not it was that way when purchased or not. If mark will send me the piston and cylinder I'll do exactly that. I can't speak anything about the ignitions because i did not then or now have a good feeling for what I was reading about the twin spark install. I can't say anything good or bad about that and I don't recall reading any word on ignition state after they were inspected by Gerhard.

Here's the clincher. If I feel the engine was in bad shape when Mark bought it after inspecting the piston and cylinder, Barry said he'd spring for the cost of the parts. If I think it happened after it was bought I think some public apologies and hand shaking needs to get moving. There was a bit more to the conversation between Barry and myself but I have no desire to inflame either side, so we won't discuss that which is not critically important to this situation. So this thing is on my back now if Mark elects to PM me to send me the parts for inspection. If not this is a dead horse.

Hopefully all that is reasonable for all. Until I hear from Mark I think everyone needs to back down a little.
 

marksextra

Well-Known Member
I just doubt that Barry decided to sell this engine at such a discount with it being 100%. He might not have known that the cylinder was trashed but I doubt he thought it was 100%. I’d like to give him the benefit of doubt that he was actually trying to be upstanding and honest, but when he
1. tells me that he thinks I trashed this engine within the first 30 seconds of run time
2. won’t provide me pictures of his tear down which would prove he knew it was sound
3. won’t respond to emails to deal with the situation
4. sends me a bad ignition by mistake
5. won’t tell me what it tached last time he ran it
6. sold the engine at such a discount
7. sold it on FG where there is not a feedback system
8. knowingly ran it hot and didn't disclose it
9. ran headers that were longer than the recommended length
10. was recently involved in another scandal
11. made a fin modification without disclosing it.
12. toolmarks indicate the cylinders were taken off and the engine had less than 10 gallon; never mentioned it

I just have a hard time. Too many things start to add up for me.

.
Ok guys, here's the deal. I just finished speaking with Barry after he reached out to me in a PM. Barry, like Mark, is a bit perplexed and would like to find a way to resolve the problem but he also wants to know how the engine got to the condition it's reputed to be in.

I'm not going to go into all the details of the conversation, and I certainly can't tell what condition anything is or was in based on all the pictures I've seen to date in this thread. As I said earlier, I never saw the piston skirts below the exhaust port levels or the cylinder walls any lower than the tops of the pistons. So here's the deal.

Let's call a truce for a little bit. No more good guy or bad guy. Barry suggested I take a look at the piston and cylinder that was returned from A.I. I agreed to do this with the understanding that I could tell if it was good or bad, but not be definitive in how or when it happened. OTH, I can develop a pretty good idea of how it happened and whether or not it was that way when purchased or not. If mark will send me the piston and cylinder I'll do exactly that. I can't speak anything about the ignitions because i did not then or now have a good feeling for what I was reading about the twin spark install. I can't say anything good or bad about that and I don't recall reading any word on ignition state after they were inspected by Gerhard.

Here's the clincher. If I feel the engine was in bad shape when Mark bought it after inspecting the piston and cylinder, Barry said he'd spring for the cost of the parts. If I think it happened after it was bought I think some public apologies and hand shaking needs to get moving. There was a bit more to the conversation between Barry and myself but I have no desire to inflame either side, so we won't discuss that which is not critically important to this situation. So this thing is on my back now if Mark elects to PM me to send me the parts for inspection. If not this is a dead horse.

Hopefully all that is reasonable for all. Until I hear from Mark I think everyone needs to back down a little.
First of all. the engine is not reputed to be in this condition. It IS in this condition. It's who did the damage that's reputed.

Second of all; there is no question that Barry sent out 3 ignitions; two of which Gerhard says are good. That's good enough for me; as Gerhard usually knows what he's talking about; AND I asked him to check the possible bad 2nd ignition twice; and he didn't mention it to be bad. If I get it back and wiggle that 2nd ignition and it's bad I'll send it off to Gerhard and get on him about it; But as it stands now; he says 2 are good to go and that's what Barry sold me. I got what I paid for.

Now; Is his offer is reasonable? Maybe. As long as it's convenient for him now right? No more good guy bad guy now that he's decided to deal with his own sale? Sorry, Pat but I'm not feeling all warm and fuzzy. Ya see, no matter what you conclude after seeing the actual parts; it won't excuse the rest of his behavior will it? Most of the above list doesn't have to do with who damaged the motor but rather it has to do with his actions. So if you find I caused the damage I should then apologize for the rest of the list above? I don't think so. And I'm terribly sorry if he's feeling some pressure now that I've had to post about his poor behavior, (AFTER a tell him about it). Too bad. This sort of peace offering is overdue by a couple weeks at least. This communication process should have been part of the sales process and should never have been brought to you in the first place. It puts YOU in the middle of MY and Barry's transaction. Not necessary. And you found out that he checked the piston before sending it? You found out the last tach readings? and so on and so on.

Being reasonable; I will of course agree to sending you my parts. I'll pm you a request for your address. But more than that? I'll have to think about it. I'm not groveling for Barry's money. I never was. I simply expected a mature transaction.
 
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BVargas

3W Flyer
First of all. the engine is not reputed to be in this condition. It IS in this condition. It's who did the damage that's reputed.

Second of all; there is no question that Barry sent out 3 ignitions; two of which Gerhard says are good. That's good enough for me; as Gerhard usually knows what he's talking about; AND I asked him to check the possible bad 2nd ignition twice; and he didn't mention it to be bad. If I get it back and wiggle that 2nd ignition and it's bad I'll send it off to Gerhard and get on him about it; cause as it stands now he says it's good to go.

Now; Is his offer is reasonable? Maybe. As long as it's convenient for him now right? No more good guy bad guy now that he's decided to deal with his own sale? Sorry, Pat but I'm not feeling all warm and fuzzy. Ya see, no matter what you conclude after seeing the actual parts; it won't excuse the rest of his behavior will it? Most of the above list doesn't have to do with who damaged the motor but rather it has to do with his actions. So if you find I caused the damage I should then apologize for the rest of the list above? I don't think so. And I'm terribly sorry if he's feeling some pressure now that I've had to post about his poor behavior, (after a tell him about it). Too bad. This sort of peace offering is overdue by a couple weeks at least. This communication process should have been part of the sales process and should never have been brought to you in the first place. It puts YOU in the middle of MY and Barry's transaction. Not necessary. And you found out that he checked the piston before sending it? You found out the last tach readings? and so on and so on.

Being reasonable; I will of course agree to sending you my parts. I'll pm you a request for your address. But more than that? I'll have to think about it. I'm not groveling for Barry's money. I never was. I simply expected a mature transaction.
Mark, just a little fyi,,, don t piss off Gerhard. It makes no sense when people are watching and/or trying to help :thumbsup:

BV
 

marksextra

Well-Known Member
Mark, just a little fyi,,, don t piss off Gerhard. It makes no sense when people are watching and/or trying to help :thumbsup:

BV
If you could let me know how you think I might have done such; I'd be happy to change anything offensive. But I don't think I've ever written anything I wouldn't want Gerhard to read if he was standing right next to me; and therefore be pissed about. I try to do that in anything I write. Literally. I won't write it if I wouldn't say it to your face. Anyways, I think me and the big guy have a pretty good relationship. Probably because neither of us allows each other to stray too far from accepted business practices. I think that establishes a healthy level of respect that keeps a good working relationship. I know some have problems with him; but I don't.
 
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red7fifty

BadAss Member
There is a reason TOM/Pat is a good moderator.......stepping up upon request to be the mediator, I'll give you props.....no pun there. :prrr:
 

red7fifty

BadAss Member
Mark, I understand your not feeling all warm and fuzzy, but cool that you'll agree to let TOM investigate, and offer insight.
With regards to some of the past dealings......well, let's just say, not everyone takes care of business the way I do. :thumbsup:
:prrr:
 
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